I don't understand how we can even call it a placebo if it isn't saline water. Even trying to call an aluminum adjuvant that's designed to rev up your immune system "a placebo" is gaslighting or just outright lying.
This is why people become anti-vax. They feel like they're openly lied to.
i hope RFKjr will tap you to design trials of these things. i'm going to be honest and tell you my bias- i am CERTAIN that the childhood vaccine schedule is responsible for virtually all of the autism epidemic and a goodly share of the chronic disease epidemic. i'm just a humble theatrical costume maker with no background in science, except in college when i learned that bad mothers cause autism, but my observations and my gut tell me that this is so and that we have hobbled generations of children to protect the profits of drug companies and to prop up the medical myths that keep the game going.
but since i won't be designing the trials, my bias won't be a problem
I think it’s toxic burden for some susceptible children: toxins in our air, food, water, body care products, and vaccines. Once we dig into that, I think it will be very revealing.
it was in the text books. they were called Schizophrenogenic mothers (refrigerator mothers) and it was believed that they had rejected the child at birth, even unconsciously. Bruno Bettelheim was the "expert" and his "settled science" blamed the mother. institutions housed these children to keep them away from their terrible mothers, books were written, therapists were trained- a whole autism infrastructure based on a completely psychological theory which disregarded all the physical symptoms beyond the lack of eye contact and the not talking.
this was the early 70's and i was a psych major.
eventually the theory fell into disrepute and now, all these years later, we just have "no idea" what causes autism (heavy sarcasm)!
several things strike me as odd about that time:
1) when a mother protested that she loved and wanted her child, the "expert", usually male, would tell her that she didn't know her own mind. there were all those "power hungry psychologist" movies, the Snake Pit (1948) and Miracle on 34th Street (1947) come to mind.
2) i raised my hand in class and said "i don't suppose there are ever any Schizophrenogenic fathers?" imagine the guilt these women felt and imagine the easy out this provided to husbands needing an excuse to get out of an untenable situation. there is a very moving documentary film called Refrigerator Mothers that you can find on line.
3) it seems to me that autism is a toxic load condition. something, probably the adjuvants in vaccines, that in certain children who don't detox well, causes brain inflammation and permanent damage. and yet in the 70's it was treated like a purely psychological issue. no amount of "psych therapy" or isolation from the "guilty" parent is going to help.
4) a contemporary flip is the trans issue which in most cases is purely psychological but is treated as if it was an actual physical condition where the body must be hormonally and surgically altered to match the delusional belief.
"The concern about vaccine trials is that if the control arm is something other than inert- salt water— the trial might hide a harm. For instance, if aluminum is harmful ..."
...
I just read Christopher Exley's 2020 book "Imagine You Are An Aluminum Atom: Discussions With Mr. Aluminum". He wrote several papers about the mechanism of how aluminum adjuvants can cause vaccine injuries (not very good for his academic career!).
I would also recommend reading Christopher P. Shaw's 2021 book "Dispatches from the Vaccine Wars." A relatively neutral survey & discussion about the history of the "vaccines wars" and the players involved. In Chapter 5, Shaw discusses "neurotoxicity and the role of aluminum adjuvants" (Shaw has published many research papers on that subject).
If anyone wants to get "into the weeds" about the HPV vaccine and it's clinical trials, take a look at Mary Holland's 2018 book "The HPV Vaccine on Trial" (she's now the President of "Children's Health Defense" after RFK stepped down).
I've had the book on my stack of books to read (eventually!?) for a couple of years and just pulled it down for a quick look. She discusses the placebo issue in CH 7: "Fauxcebos" and Placebos and AL adjuvants in CH 20: Aluminum-Containing Adjuvants: Fueling the Fire.
Dr. Thomas & Holland discuss the HPV placebo issue starting at about 23:20. They reference the book, "Turtles All the Way Down" (see pp. 112 and 174 for HPV discussion), which is a well-referenced book on "vaccine safety."
In 2000 Ed Bradley did a 60 Minutes piece on vaccines and autism. The press was still doing journalism back then and it was very balanced. Bradley attended a large meeting of parents of autistic children - the meeting had nothing to do with vaccines - and asked them who believed their child's autism was caused by a vaccine. About 80% of the attendees stood. That was enough to convince me - maybe 5 or 10% could be mistaken, but not 80%. They were there, they saw it happen.
How about using sterile water for the control arm rather than saline? Due to the hypotonicity of sterile water, that shot would cause pain too, even if for a relatively short duration. Just a thought…
Looking at the stats - 7/6000 deaths in the full HPV vaccine, 5/6000 deaths in placebo. Is a 1 in 1000 death rate normal for that age group? Seems like that's around one death a year for a public high school. I don't feel like I've gotten that many notices from ours. Like none in 3 years. What period of time for the followup?
I would guess Jha has never conducted a RCT. A second control group of saline would be a more rigorous in defining side effects and efficacy as well as an honest and thorough way to evaluate vaccines. Its time to stop the nonsensical statements and move towards solid evidence based processes. Even Dr Deborah Birk gets that.
I appreciate your points and I'm glad you finally brought it up about the lack of true inert placebos in the RCTs for vaccines. Or the saline placebo group is small and then is deliberately embedded in the aluminum containing "placebo" group, such as was done for the HPV vaccine RCT. This, of course, hides the independent adverse effects of the aluminum containing "placebo"-- everything looks equal between the two groups.
The other elephant in the room is that the HPV "placebo" (containing the strong aluminum adjuvant) produces a 60% systemic effect! What kind of true inert placebo would do that?
BTW, this is unrelated. But as RFK looks into adverse affects, say, regarding Autism, has anyone explored the use of ultrasound during pregnancy? When I was pregnant I had one ultrasound. Now they are done on a regular basis. US is definitely something -along with all the vaccinations - that has changed significantly since I was a kid back in the 50’s. Interesting that in 1956 the first thing the inventor used diagnostic US on was the head off a fetus.
Aluminum is a very reactive atom with several oxidation states. The reason they use it is that it is guaranteed to cause trouble at the injection site and so bring a greater supply of blood (and antibodies) to the site when they might not otherwise show up in high enough numbers.
There is a potential cost for the service that the aluminum performs,
The chemist Chris Exley has a good book on the problems in using Aluminum
I am totally stunned at the concept of a placebo that is not inert. Was the idea that the trial was (vaccine + aluminum adjuvant) versus only aluminum? That would at least make some sense
Excellent article. What if aluminum and other inert chemicals create problems too? How do you differentiate and conclude which ingredient creates issues? I agree that more than one arm may be helpful.
I don't understand how we can even call it a placebo if it isn't saline water. Even trying to call an aluminum adjuvant that's designed to rev up your immune system "a placebo" is gaslighting or just outright lying.
This is why people become anti-vax. They feel like they're openly lied to.
Exactly. It's a good example of why Trump was elected. Enough of the lies and gaslighting.
"They feel like they're openly lied to."
That's because they absolutely HAVE been openly lied to.
i hope RFKjr will tap you to design trials of these things. i'm going to be honest and tell you my bias- i am CERTAIN that the childhood vaccine schedule is responsible for virtually all of the autism epidemic and a goodly share of the chronic disease epidemic. i'm just a humble theatrical costume maker with no background in science, except in college when i learned that bad mothers cause autism, but my observations and my gut tell me that this is so and that we have hobbled generations of children to protect the profits of drug companies and to prop up the medical myths that keep the game going.
but since i won't be designing the trials, my bias won't be a problem
I think it’s toxic burden for some susceptible children: toxins in our air, food, water, body care products, and vaccines. Once we dig into that, I think it will be very revealing.
Wow. Someone told you "bad mothers cause autism"???? That's pretty crappy.
it was in the text books. they were called Schizophrenogenic mothers (refrigerator mothers) and it was believed that they had rejected the child at birth, even unconsciously. Bruno Bettelheim was the "expert" and his "settled science" blamed the mother. institutions housed these children to keep them away from their terrible mothers, books were written, therapists were trained- a whole autism infrastructure based on a completely psychological theory which disregarded all the physical symptoms beyond the lack of eye contact and the not talking.
this was the early 70's and i was a psych major.
eventually the theory fell into disrepute and now, all these years later, we just have "no idea" what causes autism (heavy sarcasm)!
several things strike me as odd about that time:
1) when a mother protested that she loved and wanted her child, the "expert", usually male, would tell her that she didn't know her own mind. there were all those "power hungry psychologist" movies, the Snake Pit (1948) and Miracle on 34th Street (1947) come to mind.
2) i raised my hand in class and said "i don't suppose there are ever any Schizophrenogenic fathers?" imagine the guilt these women felt and imagine the easy out this provided to husbands needing an excuse to get out of an untenable situation. there is a very moving documentary film called Refrigerator Mothers that you can find on line.
3) it seems to me that autism is a toxic load condition. something, probably the adjuvants in vaccines, that in certain children who don't detox well, causes brain inflammation and permanent damage. and yet in the 70's it was treated like a purely psychological issue. no amount of "psych therapy" or isolation from the "guilty" parent is going to help.
4) a contemporary flip is the trans issue which in most cases is purely psychological but is treated as if it was an actual physical condition where the body must be hormonally and surgically altered to match the delusional belief.
https://blogs.uoregon.edu/autismhistoryproject/people/312-2/
"The concern about vaccine trials is that if the control arm is something other than inert- salt water— the trial might hide a harm. For instance, if aluminum is harmful ..."
...
I just read Christopher Exley's 2020 book "Imagine You Are An Aluminum Atom: Discussions With Mr. Aluminum". He wrote several papers about the mechanism of how aluminum adjuvants can cause vaccine injuries (not very good for his academic career!).
I would also recommend reading Christopher P. Shaw's 2021 book "Dispatches from the Vaccine Wars." A relatively neutral survey & discussion about the history of the "vaccines wars" and the players involved. In Chapter 5, Shaw discusses "neurotoxicity and the role of aluminum adjuvants" (Shaw has published many research papers on that subject).
Claim was that there have been “many” placebo-inclusive trials of the HPV vaccine, and here’s one. Problem being the placebo wasn’t inert.
So obviously the question now is, were any of the other “many” trials conducted with an inert placebo injection?
No. https://icandecide.org/article/childhood-vaccine-trials-summary-chart/
Aluminum is a neurotoxin
Period.
There’s no place for using it in the placebo arm. NONE.
If anyone wants to get "into the weeds" about the HPV vaccine and it's clinical trials, take a look at Mary Holland's 2018 book "The HPV Vaccine on Trial" (she's now the President of "Children's Health Defense" after RFK stepped down).
I've had the book on my stack of books to read (eventually!?) for a couple of years and just pulled it down for a quick look. She discusses the placebo issue in CH 7: "Fauxcebos" and Placebos and AL adjuvants in CH 20: Aluminum-Containing Adjuvants: Fueling the Fire.
P.S. While cutting up veggies for the stew for dinner, I've been listening to an interview with Mary Holland about the HPV vaccine. https://rumble.com/v6ehfep-with-the-wind-with-dr.-paul-show-169.html?e9s=src_v1_mfp
Dr. Thomas & Holland discuss the HPV placebo issue starting at about 23:20. They reference the book, "Turtles All the Way Down" (see pp. 112 and 174 for HPV discussion), which is a well-referenced book on "vaccine safety."
In 2000 Ed Bradley did a 60 Minutes piece on vaccines and autism. The press was still doing journalism back then and it was very balanced. Bradley attended a large meeting of parents of autistic children - the meeting had nothing to do with vaccines - and asked them who believed their child's autism was caused by a vaccine. About 80% of the attendees stood. That was enough to convince me - maybe 5 or 10% could be mistaken, but not 80%. They were there, they saw it happen.
How about using sterile water for the control arm rather than saline? Due to the hypotonicity of sterile water, that shot would cause pain too, even if for a relatively short duration. Just a thought…
Looking at the stats - 7/6000 deaths in the full HPV vaccine, 5/6000 deaths in placebo. Is a 1 in 1000 death rate normal for that age group? Seems like that's around one death a year for a public high school. I don't feel like I've gotten that many notices from ours. Like none in 3 years. What period of time for the followup?
I would guess Jha has never conducted a RCT. A second control group of saline would be a more rigorous in defining side effects and efficacy as well as an honest and thorough way to evaluate vaccines. Its time to stop the nonsensical statements and move towards solid evidence based processes. Even Dr Deborah Birk gets that.
Jesus MY arm HURTS just thinking of aluminum in it! What’s next, Fairy dust?? Please tell me Jha is gone now.
I appreciate your points and I'm glad you finally brought it up about the lack of true inert placebos in the RCTs for vaccines. Or the saline placebo group is small and then is deliberately embedded in the aluminum containing "placebo" group, such as was done for the HPV vaccine RCT. This, of course, hides the independent adverse effects of the aluminum containing "placebo"-- everything looks equal between the two groups.
The other elephant in the room is that the HPV "placebo" (containing the strong aluminum adjuvant) produces a 60% systemic effect! What kind of true inert placebo would do that?
BTW, this is unrelated. But as RFK looks into adverse affects, say, regarding Autism, has anyone explored the use of ultrasound during pregnancy? When I was pregnant I had one ultrasound. Now they are done on a regular basis. US is definitely something -along with all the vaccinations - that has changed significantly since I was a kid back in the 50’s. Interesting that in 1956 the first thing the inventor used diagnostic US on was the head off a fetus.
A couple months ago, "A Midwestern Doctor" did a nice write-up on the subject: https://www.midwesterndoctor.com/p/the-forgotten-dangers-of-ultrasound?utm_source=publication-search
Thank you!
Aluminum is a very reactive atom with several oxidation states. The reason they use it is that it is guaranteed to cause trouble at the injection site and so bring a greater supply of blood (and antibodies) to the site when they might not otherwise show up in high enough numbers.
There is a potential cost for the service that the aluminum performs,
The chemist Chris Exley has a good book on the problems in using Aluminum
I am totally stunned at the concept of a placebo that is not inert. Was the idea that the trial was (vaccine + aluminum adjuvant) versus only aluminum? That would at least make some sense
Excellent article. What if aluminum and other inert chemicals create problems too? How do you differentiate and conclude which ingredient creates issues? I agree that more than one arm may be helpful.